Hallo what kind of CE Certification does the machine have?
thank you very much
Hi Akopp,
We CE our machines to various EU directives and make use of multiple EN standards. Specifically EN60825-1-2014 
The declaration can be found in manual
https://indd.adobe.com/view/f4e5dd6b-9db8-480d-ac57-8eb9e297c1f5
If you have any questions about the machine or safety features just ask
Kind regards,
Bonne
I thanks Bonnie. I think you got an error in the CE Dokument
“The Machinery Directive is mutually exclusive with the Low Voltage Directive, so that either one or the other will apply but never both. Annex 1 of the Machinery Directive contains requirements for electrical safety which precisely mirror those of the LVD”
Also you did not mention RoHS and Reach …
Hi Akopp,
Ill have another look into that, we were recommended we apply these directives via the software we use to compile the documentation. Ill have to reread the text too as i don’t recall the directive text stating they are mutually exclusive even though the LVD is basically covered in the MD.
If you look around you will see quite a few manufacturers of laser cutters have both directives listed. While others list solely the LVD (Which I find odd as the Laser would mean MD in my opinion). For RoHS we source components which are compliant. Ill have to look into if it should be on the declaration again like the question of LVD or MD or both some manufactures of laser cutters have RoHS listed others don’t. Reach is for importers and manufactures of chemicals not somthing we do.
Hope things are going well with Erfindergarden its quite a while ago since we last spoke; Berlin maker fair I think? I can imagine Covid has made it tricky for your workshops.
Just wondering do you have a copy of the DOC for your GF? Always curious what they listed on theirs. The people with a GF I know in NL never saw one or lost/don’t recall receiving it.
Kind regards,
Bonne
I think its all covered in the Machine Directive if you have one. I think the LVD is when you dont have a machine. Both is too much.
Yes workshops only only at the moment and I want to do some small scale production with the lasercutters or 3dprinters and looking for a bigger lasercutter because of that.
I just asked Glowforge about their DOC. I do not have it either. I talked to Teja yesterday and he gave me some tipps. You can google his DOC. He lists the MD and the RoHS. I am also member of Fablab Oberland where they have a Fabcreator now but have not used it yet.
Just skimming both directive again, (btw you can find the full originals ones for free on Eur-lex)
I found the bit which I think is the cause for the confusion.
Basically you must apply the content of the LVD (or use it as guidance), but its covered in the MD so basically you don’t need to announce the LVD.
“1.5. RISKS DUE TO OTHER HAZARDS
1.5.1. Electricity supply
Where machinery has an electricity supply, it must be designed, constructed and equipped in such a way that all hazards of an electrical nature are or can be prevented.
The safety objectives set out in Directive 73/23/EEC shall apply to machinery. However, the obligations
concerning conformity assessment and the placing on the market and/or putting into service of machinery with regard to electrical hazards are governed solely by this Directive.”
Just to help with your research I have linked the manuals from the two big players with their DOC inside.
Apply MD and LVD
The German version (pretty old but only one on their site)
Only mentions LVD
Apply MD and LVD
However this one only has the MD.
Non of them mention RoHS, but one would assume they are using RoHS components. (We have too)
Interestingly Trotec manual from 2019 no longer mentions the LVD and now revisiting the text i can see the interpretation that does indeed imply the LVD does not need to be listed. I will update our documents for the next batch of machines.
Oberland have been using the FabCore for a while now, seem quite happy with it i get the occasional photo or newspaper clipping from them 
How big a laser cutter are you looking for?
We have a FabCore Plus coming soon, Assembling the first this week Basically its the FabKit Mk6 but assembled and looks like a FabCore.
Looking for somthing even bigger, faster and more powerful then the FabPro, but he is quite a bit more expensive and will not be ready for another few months.
Curious what tips Teja gave 
and if GF respond with a DOC 
If you have any practical questions about the systems we employ for safety I’m more than happy to walk you through them.
Btw if you ever want to read the EN standards you can get them from Estonia for a very reasonable price https://www.evs.ee/et/
Kind regards,
Bonne
1 Like
Thanks for the tipps! Teja just told me to use an consultant and that I as a importer are like the producer and need to do idependet tests.
I think its the dircetive MD, EMC and ROHS and also Funk if you use wifi. I have not gotten into standards. I will check if I can get it from Estonia.
This is also a great website
Yes I am looking for a machine in the size of the Fabpro 1300x900.
this is mr. beams
Are you planning to import directly from china then? In which case Teja is correct as an importer you are responsible to ensure it meets EU directives. However hiring a consultant to CE a product for a singular import for your own use would be very expensive and odd thing to do.
Personally I would recommend buying a machine from a local manufacturer who has already taken the time to design and manufacturer a machine in europe. However I may be a little bias
If you have any other questions let me know
Kind regards,
Bonne
I wont hire a consultant but do it myself and see if I can find somebody who has a look on it from my community. In any case I think I will be the only one using this machine.
When is your big machine ready?
Also I talked with people who bought chinese Lasercutters from a German importer. There you also have to check if you find a good one.
I want it to be ready to order before the end of the first quarter.
Our original planning kind of fell apart with Covid (Like most planning/timetables last year 
) Finally catching up with backorders and then more time is available for design and producing the pre-production FabPro. The First prototype has been working with a nearby early bird customer for about a year now, we tweaked the design during the time to fine tune it We have a few photos and short clips on a blog post on our website https://www.fabcreator.com/fabpro-passthrough-at-work.
@akopp did you ever hear back from GF on their declaration?
yes they have send me the DOC in the meantime. But i am still waiting for the ROHS. You also dont have this right?
Would you mind sharing it? Curious to what they list.
No its not somthing we currently list, we do make sure components we are ROHS as they have to be.
Its not mentioned in the manuals I linked above either. However I’m fairly sure they are all ROHS compliant.
Also I believe GF got TUV to approve it, so a well known 3rd party did not notice or say ROHS should be on it? Honestly I think more needs to be done to demystify CE.
I think its not TÜV.
I remember them making noise about getting TUV Rhineland to certify it.
“Certified to UL/ANSI/IEC 60950-1-07 and CAN/CSA-C22.2 NO. 60950-1-07 (R16) by TUV Rhineland”
IEC 60950-1 is a strange one to use for a laser cutter